#12 | Brian Touhy | Rigged Games, Michael Jordan, and Phony Fights | "There's Magnets In The Basketballs"

Could the high-stakes world of professional sports be a stage for something more sinister than just competition? Brian Touhy, an expert in sports conspiracy theories, joins us to share insights that could forever change how you view the final scores. We're peeling back the curtain to reveal unnerving patterns in Super Bowl logos and numerological oddities that may point to prearranged outcomes. From the peculiar turns of a football to the sudden stops of a basketball, our conversation explores the possibility of technological tampering in sports, leaving the door open to a world where not everything is as it appears.

The integrity of sports is further questioned as we delve into the seedy reality of fixed fights, stretching from the boxing rings to the MMA octagons. The revelation that some matchups may be carefully choreographed ballets of brutality offers a sobering perspective on the unseen forces shaping sports legends. Moreover, we dive into the saga of Michael Jordan's gambling controversy, unearthing murky details that suggest his first retirement from the NBA may have been more than just a personal choice.

Amid government subsidies and societal distractions, we ponder the weight of sports in our culture, and how these grand spectacles might serve purposes beyond entertainment. From the fanatical following of teams to the potential orchestration behind legendary careers, we investigate the psychological impact on devotees grappling with the idea of their cherished games being manipulated. As we embark on our own venture into wrestling promotion, we confront the complexities of ensuring integrity in sport.

Brian Touhy's website: The Fix Is In

Transcript

Mike Straus: 0:00

Anticon. So here we are, brother, another classic session for everybody to digest. This time we have a sports Conspiracy expert. Actually, he's like the sports conspiracy guy mr Brian to me.

Tom Higgins: 0:30

I'm excited for this one dude when I looked him up, the title that I saw was Supreme Court scholarly authority on sports fixing. And yeah, I'm excited for this one too because my dad's big sports fan, a lot of my friends are big sports fans. I've gotten into it with them. Before saying how fixed everything is and and hopefully I sound good because I'm gonna give myself a little humble brag, being so bad with technology I finally got the computer and microphone set up. Despite weeks of Mike trying to help me out, I think I finally did the bare minimum here, so Hopefully I'm sounding good.

Mike Straus: 1:08

Do you sound great?

Tom Higgins: 1:08

something, something that I've been using to, you know, try and sway people into Thinking that sports is fake or fixed or whatever. It has to do with some numerology shit that I uncovered Last year from a page that would post about that type of stuff. So here I'm gonna tell you about it too.

Mike Straus: 1:26

This is super crazy.

Tom Higgins: 1:27

LeBron last season was About to break Karim Abdul-Jabbar's record, after the record had been standing for 38 years, and LeBron was 38 years old last year. When he was gonna do it it was on the 38th day of the year, 308 days after the 38th year anniversary of that record. To break the record, lebron would have surpassed 38,388 career points and the guy who posted this said wild guess scores LeBron. Wild guess says LeBron scores 38 points. How many fucking points you think LeBron scored that game? 38? No, he did it, yes, and then they added to it Karim set the record in the 38th NBA season and then LeBron was born 38 weeks after that record.

Mike Straus: 2:16

Come on.

Tom Higgins: 2:18

I know. So I don't know if our guest is a numerology guy. I know he focuses mostly on you know, how sports are fixed and ways that they could be fixed, but uh, yeah, I'm gonna definitely bring that up to him See what he thinks. I think that's just so nuts dude.

Mike Straus: 2:34

Dude, that is fucking one of the craziest things I've ever heard in any kind of conspiracy ever, let alone sports.

Tom Higgins: 2:41

I mean, I've seen a lot going on or going around with people talking about how every year, the Super Bowl logo has like two shades of color on it and it's the, the teams that end up inevitably being in the Super Bowl, and that's like a I don't know a foreshadowing or a nod To it being fixed. I think even Aaron Rodgers was talking about it, which is kind of crazy.

Mike Straus: 3:02

You can't put anything past. I mean, okay, nothing is sacred. I heard him when I was doing some research for this episode or for this session. I Heard Brian Tuey say Listen, there's corruption in everything. There's corruption in politics, government, there's corruption in the school system, there's corruption in In Fortune 500 companies and everything. Why would you think that sports is the one exception? When you put it like that, it's like it really clicks, even for the people that kind of want to think that sports is like this sacred domain that you know. Yeah, there's corruption in all those areas, but not not sports, not not in billions dollars.

Mike Straus: 3:47

Entertainment business right right, well, uh yeah, housekeeping everybody. If you're digging what we're putting out there, follow us on all the social medias, whether it's Twitter, x, facebook, instagram, patreon, youtube, all that good stuff. We did finally get to podcast up on YouTube, however. Episode number first strike.

Mike Straus: 4:10

Yeah, session 9, the most recent one that Tom and I did. We got a little strike and they removed it from YouTube because of misinformation, so I'm going to Re-edit that part out, try to repost it and see if um if YouTube will accept that, but either way, you could still get that Session number nine available on all the other streaming platforms. So check that out, patreon. We're still working on, we're gonna get that up and running, but you can be one of the very first syndicate members.

Tom Higgins: 4:37

And yeah, any show ideas, questions concerns comments, whatever she does, an email conspiracy and chill at yahoocom and Got anything else bet not gonna lie, I consider that, uh, that strike after just about not even 24 hours of being on YouTube a bit of a badge of honor that we're doing something right, if the powers that be already putting the sensor ban on us do not even 24 hours.

Mike Straus: 5:03

What do you say? Okay? So yesterday I applied for a YouTube podcast License thing. I got accepted and it said it that it'll be within 24 hours or so, that they'll tell me or that they'll shoot me an email and Basically give me the go ahead and I'm okay to post podcasts. Well, I got that email, I guess sometime in the middle of night. I woke up this morning and the email was there. So when I got to work this morning I Breakfast and then shortly after that about seven o'clock, I Proceeded to work my way through all of the the red tape, bullshit that I had to do to get to podcast up on YouTube. And I would say maybe around 8 30 is when the podcasts were uploading to YouTube. So you're talking roughly four or five hours.

Mike Straus: 5:53

It was up there bro.

Tom Higgins: 5:55

Yeah, there's some sounds. Get us already.

Mike Straus: 5:57

I mean shit, we really didn't even hit any crazy. You know topics we I don't want to get this one struck, but you know we just talked a little bit about some of the the fuckery that went on in the year of 2020, if you know what I'm saying if we want to stay up on YouTube, we're gonna.

Tom Higgins: 6:14

We're gonna have to get some code words going.

Mike Straus: 6:17

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, we're gonna have to figure that out, or we could just do like, like I said, the Mario, the Mario jump noise, or you know, yeah, I like that. That's always a good one. I can't really think of anything else. I guess should we just Let him hear the conversation we have with Brian to enjoy. Yeah, welcome to the show man conspiracy and chill. When it comes to sports conspiracies, man, you're pretty much the guy, as far as I know, yeah.

Brian Touhy: 6:42

I think I'm the only one doing this, so I Mean I'm sure there's other. There's a lot of people on YouTube who do something similar, but a lot of them copy what I've done and don't give me credit for it and at the same time, a lot of them just throw Anything and everything up against the wall, just kind of to see what sticks. And so what I try to do, and what I always try to do, is Prove my point through research and through quotes and talking to people and gathering as much information as I can and trying to connect the dots. So it's a different way of doing things and I want to say it's more scholarly way of doing things, but it's a more legitimate way of doing things than just saying all this is this because and not having it really Evidence to back up what you're saying- and anybody who has read any of your books whether it's the fixes in Larson, a games season in the abyss and the fix is still in knows that is that's.

Mike Straus: 7:41

That's not just words. You're saying. That's really the approach that you take. You are really all about evidence. So I Do appreciate that.

Brian Touhy: 7:49

Yeah, it's. It's like I say, it's one thing to just say it and spout awful I think this is fixed because but it's another thing to actually prove your point through, like you say, through evidence and research.

Mike Straus: 8:01

What got you into wanting to study and research sports conspiracies?

Brian Touhy: 8:05

Kind of happened by accident. To be honest, kind of funny, I really I went to school to be a screenwriter and I tried doing that for a long time and I had minor success, although I never had anything produced, but I had a manager out in Hollywood and that sort of thing. But my wife was telling me basically write a book, and the first kind of idea I had my head was this sports conspiracy idea, because it was a book like I wanted to read but nobody had written before. So I kind of took it by myself to write that book. That's what became the fixes in and and I kind of started doing some promotion and that sort of thing on into it. I Realized nobody was talking about this subject. Nobody was talking about game fixing or the possibility, game fixing, whether it's from an entertainment standpoint or from a gambling standpoint. It seemed to be just a big void. And so I kind of stepped into that open hole and Did what I could to fight the good fight.

Mike Straus: 9:03

Man, there's so many things I wanted to want to ask you and talk to you about.

Mike Straus: 9:07

You know time comes from a wrestling background up not a pro wrestling but, like I said, a catch wrestling background and I come from a mixed martial arts journalist background. There's no shortage of Conspiracies and avenues we can take, but the one thing I wanted to ask you right off the jump is Recently, a couple days ago, you had retweeted a Still frame from a news broadcast that somehow already knew who was going to be in the Super Bowl. What is going on with that dude?

Brian Touhy: 9:38

well, that's one of those weird things that could just be a one-off accident Accident. It just so happened that, whatever the newscast was I think it was actually somewhere in Canada, although I think the Tweet that I referenced said it was in Memphis or something like that, I don't remember. But basically, in the the news broadcast, they said the halftime show for a Super Bowl is going to feature usher and these other artists, and the Super Bowl is going to Be played between San Francisco 49ers and the Baltimore Ravens, which, as we know, is for talking right now. That hasn't happened yet, although both teams are still alive, and so a lot of people jumped on that.

Brian Touhy: 10:16

I had a lot of people Send that to me, either through email or my Twitter account or what have you, and say, hey, did you see this? And I mean there's been other cases where you know things have jumped the gun and they've said, oh, you know, this teams, they're gonna be the champion or whatever, and sometimes approved to be right and sometimes approved to be wrong. It could be just one of those things where, like, whoever was doing the news broadcast had to fill in the blanks, and they didn't really think about the blanks they were filling in when they did that, or maybe they know it will find out soon enough, right?

Mike Straus: 10:48

Yeah, we will, and that that was that was tweeted before Either of those teams had won that week too. So yeah, I don't know, man, it's crazy. I know you got some stuff, but they were both the number one seeds.

Brian Touhy: 10:58

So I mean, true, you know, I try not to see. Those are the kind of things I try not to read too much. And you know because that's that could just be a coincidence that, like I said, one off happens, dance thing. But you know, when you dig into the subject there's more to it than just something like that.

Mike Straus: 11:15

For sure.

Tom Higgins: 11:16

Yeah, I was gonna say I'm sure you've seen the Talk lately of people citing the logos, how the logos will have like a tint of two colors and be like oh, this is foreshadowing which teams are gonna be in, and this year features red and purple, so yeah, that's another one.

Brian Touhy: 11:30

That's the past two Super Bowls that did seem to play out, though that's the interesting thing with the logos is that the colors Within the Roman numerals did seem to match the two teams that wound up playing, like last year's was kind of green and red and we had the chiefs playing the Eagles and I forgot was the year before what the colors were, but I matched the two teams as well. So you know, and that's almost one reason, I think almost for sure that it's not gonna be the Niners and the Ravens, because that became again. That was another thing that kind of trended on Twitter for a while, like before I think even the playoffs started, and I think the NFL I know the NFL is aware of what I've done and I know the NFL is aware, really aware, of things like hashtag, nfl rigged Twitter.

Tom Higgins: 12:17

I Will say this much I can remember a game when Peyton Manning was on the Broncos and it was like it was either the AFC championship or the game just before and they were playing the Ravens and it was like the the final play of the game or what should have been, and the Broncos threw up like a Hail Mary and the defender, like you said, obvious and I was like you couldn't get any more obvious than this when I was watching it at the time the cornerback was Barely covering the guy and, like it was, he should have been double, triple covered. They were throwing a Hail Mary to win the game and the guy like botched it so bad. He like jumped way ahead of the time and there's no way the guy Misjudged it to that level. I was like holy crap, that was. That was completely fixed. Like that's just one of the moments I can recall. I don't know if either you guys remember that exact moment, but that was extremely suspect.

Brian Touhy: 13:11

I don't remember that one distinctly, but there's been so many Plays by players and calls by referees over the I mean, I started doing this like 15s, they're so years ago. There's so many of them and that's the part that I think Fans should wake up to is you know, if it happened once A year or once every two years, you'd say, okay, well, that was a bad play, that was a bad call. But when you see it week after week, and it seems to benefit certain teams over other teams all the time, and those same teams are tied to the main storylines that the league and their broadcast partners are pushing, that's when you start going well, wait a second. Is this just a happy accident or is this controlled? Is this being manipulated? Is it what the NFL and the broadcast, you know networks want? Because that's what's going to drive fans to the games and that's what's going to make everybody live. Yes, oh yeah, just like when they had.

Brian Touhy: 14:01

Ray.

Tom Higgins: 14:01

Lewis's last season ends in a Super Bowl. They had the Harbaugh brothers perfectly lined up to make it to the Super Bowl.

Brian Touhy: 14:07

I, yeah, yeah, peyton Manning, go out on top in Super Bowl 50 and Jerome Bedis In the home Super Bowl in Detroit. You had Saints after Hurricane Katrina. I mean you go on and on. There's so many storylines that have come true that you know. That's why I started Doing this, as I saw too many coincidences that seem to benefit the league and I said you know, I don't believe in coincidences. When it's tied to a billion dollars or more, it's no longer coincidence, it's a business plan.

Mike Straus: 14:35

Sure is one of one of my favorite storylines and I predicted it too was it was September 11th. You know 2001, that horrible day that we all remember. But uh, who won that year's Super Bowl? The Patriots and. They came out of nowhere because they weren't like this juggernaut powerhouse team. As a matter of fact, no, they beat the greatest show on turf. They had no business winning that game, you know no. So, yeah, that was interesting.

Brian Touhy: 15:03

Well, because it was interesting too, for that Is because of what happened on 9 11 and how America changed immediately after. People forget that the NFL changed the logo of the Super Bowl right after that to become a more patriotic thing. You know, it all became a patriotic in the Patriots. The Patriots were the first team in NFL history that wasn't introduced, you know like, had their starting lineup introduced. They all just came out of the field as a team. I mean, it was like this whole, you know, sounds conspiratorial, but this whole, like you know, psyop thing where they were trying to, you know, push this message on the American people through the NFL and through this football game, which, of course, was the most watched of the NFL television program of the year. And you know, that is one of the things that you know makes you stand up and go wait a second. Was this planned or was this, you know, just lucky on the NFL's part? And again, I don't believe in luck when it's tied to a billion dollars.

Tom Higgins: 16:03

Honestly, and I believe the Saints also won the Super Bowl after Hurricane Katrina too.

Brian Touhy: 16:09

Yeah, it took them a couple of years to get there, but the first year, immediately after Hurricane Katrina, they made it to the NFC championship game and lost to the Bears, who went on to lose the Super Bowl to the Colts. Which is kind of odd, because when the Saints did get to the Super Bowl, they again played Peyton Manning. So it was almost like it was supposed to happen but it didn't happen. And then to me it seemed like Peyton Manning threw that Super Bowl to make sure the Saints won it.

Tom Higgins: 16:34

Yeah, I was going to say Mike and I are from Chicago, so so, like well, I was a Bears fan and plenty of suffering as a Bears fan.

Tom Higgins: 16:45

I was also a Bills fan too and uh, no, yeah, exactly, I don't really watch football much anymore and I know that the Bills are kind of good now. But something I noticed back a long time ago when I was a Bills fan and I was kind of noticing like they were getting screwed they even put a complaint in with the league one year, like that they were facing more teams with extra time off by like a massive disproportion, like they would have a bye week or they'd be playing a team coming off a bye week. They'd be playing a team coming off a Thursday night. Like they just had a disproportionate amount of teams that had extra preparation. And I guess I believe it was only the Browns owners and the Bills owner who voted no for Commissioner Goodell to like approve him as the commissioner, and then we saw how well those teams did for, however many years, and I don't think that's a coincidence.

Brian Touhy: 17:38

No, no, I think there's. I think one of the things people always like to look at starting lineups and had coaches and they had sort of thing for the NFL. But I think it's who has the power within the ownership of the NFL. Because people think, well, roger Goodell runs the NFL. No, he doesn't. The owners run the NFL. They employ Roger Goodell. If they didn't like what he was doing, they'd get rid of him. And it always cracks me up because Roger Goodell comes out at like the NFL draft or after Super Bowl and all the fans boo him. You know, it's like Vince McMahon coming out there, boo, they all go crazy and he kind of smiles and he plays that role and it's like if he was doing that bad of a job, the owners would get rid of him. But he's making them billions of dollars and they love him and so those are the guys you have to worry about the owners. They're the ones who control it.

Brian Touhy: 18:25

I think certain owners, like Robert Kraft with the Patriots, have more power within the league than other owners do, because Robert Kraft had a lot of ties to the broadcast television networks and getting to the media rights for the league and I think that's one of the reasons why the Patriots did so well and got so many calls is because he brought a lot of money to a lot of people. And I also think it's one of the reasons why the Cowboys continue to lose because Jerry Jones doesn't share his revenue like the other NFL owners do. When Jerry Jones built that billion dollar stadium down in Texas the new one certain revenue streams from that stadium and from the Cowboys he keeps himself. He doesn't share like the revenue from buying merchandise like Cowboys hats and t-shirts and that sort of things All the other teams do. He does not.

Brian Touhy: 19:10

And so I think a lot of the NFL owners don't like it. They're not happy with them. They can't get rid of them, necessarily because they haven't done anything wrong, but at the same time I think they can gang up on them and be like yeah, if you're not gonna give us money, guess what? You're not gonna get the calls and you're not getting to the Super Bowl without the calls. So if you wanna keep your money, keep your money, but you're not gonna be a Super Bowl contender like that, and they sure haven't been for a long time.

Mike Straus: 19:36

So I think that most people who don't wanna hear that their beloved sports could be fixed or are fixed, I think their biggest gripe would be okay then, who's fixing it? How are they doing it? What do you think? You think that the quarterback's just out there purposely? So my question would be how are they doing it and who and how?

Brian Touhy: 20:04

Well, the first thing is is you know people say, well, there'll be too many people involved, everybody. If there's so many people involved, everybody would know about it in a secret or get out. Well, the fact of the matter is you don't have to A fix every game. And I don't think every game is fixed. I don't think it is professional wrestling. I think if there's, certain games are tweaked, I think certain games are manipulated to keep them close to the very end, but I don't think it's every game is scripted.

Brian Touhy: 20:27

At the beginning of the season they say, oh, t-max is gonna win the Super Bowl, here's how we're gonna do it. I don't think that happens at all, but I think, in order to do it, I think the easiest way to do it through most of the sports, be it football, basketball, hockey, is officiating. Clearly, certain calls benefit certain teams, hinder other teams, affect the play and affect the outcomes of the games. And most of the calls that are made in all those sports are highly subjective. Because, you know, we've all heard it, we've all been watching football games or basketball games or what have you and heard even the broadcasters say, boy, they're really letting them play out there. Well, if they're really letting them play, that means they're not enforcing the rules. And so what are they out there doing? And if and when they do enforce the rules, when they call holding or passing or a clearance or what have you, why do they suddenly do it now? Why is it suddenly now that it's egregious enough that they get flagged? But you know the other 10 times beforehand they didn't bother to call it. So I think the officiating is the easiest way to manipulate a game, to fix an outcome.

Brian Touhy: 21:28

But you can get and people don't think so because the players make so much money but you can get the players and get them to throw a game, to fix a game, to shave points. I mean and I think it happens way more than people assume, because the players don't make as much money as people assume. And even if they do make a bunch of money, I mean you have guys like especially in basketball, the NBA, I mean guy like Antoine Walker for the Celtics. I think he made over $110 million in the NBA and he's bankrupt. He blew it all. So just because a guy makes a lot of money doesn't mean he doesn't go through. It, doesn't mean he doesn't lose. It Doesn't mean there aren't taxes taken out and lawyer fees and agent fees and that sort of thing. And certain players, especially in the NFL on rookie contracts, aren't getting paid that much.

Brian Touhy: 22:11

So I think there is way to blackmail players even through, you know, performance and anti-drug testing and that sort of thing. There's ways to get players. There's even ways to get the head coaches, because how many times have you seen a head coach who's three and you know 15 or whatever with an NFL team? Maybe three and 15, three and 14. But anyway, with an NFL team he loses job and two years later he's coaching for another team. You know, these guys get recycled so much. Maybe it's because they're company players and they'll do what they're told. And again, it doesn't have to be every game, just certain games here and there that they have to throw.

Mike Straus: 22:45

Yeah, I think you're right on. I think you're right on with all that. It only takes, you know, it only takes one call at a certain particular moment of the game to completely change the outcome. And it reminds me of a saying you know, you've never, I've never met a bookie that has a part-time job. You know, they somehow always, they always know just where that points line is gonna be, and I understand they're good at their job. But how good can you really be? You mentioned basketball. One of the things I wanted to talk to you about was, you know, we mentioned we're from Chicago, in my case, just outside, like you had mentioned. Outside, it's just a lot easier to tell people you're from Chicago when you're from like.

Tom Higgins: 23:27

Lumbar, you know, yeah, exactly.

Mike Straus: 23:29

But exactly right right. But, with basketball. You know, we had the sudden Derrick Rose. We won the Derrick. Rose lottery in the 80s the Knicks won the Patrick Ewing lottery and then LeBron gets traded, but then, miraculously, the Cleveland Cavaliers get the number one pick a few years after that. So can you talk a little bit about the NBA and if and how they fixed the draft lottery?

Brian Touhy: 23:57

Well, the early draft lotteries were very easy to rig, especially the original one with Patrick Ewing in 1985, when they came out there to big giant envelopes with a broom and a hopper. And even if you watched that I mean if you pay attention you could see how they fixed it and made sure that the Knicks got the number one pick. But you know, again, it goes back to the fact that the owners run the league. They own the league. So if they decide, hey, we're gonna benefit this team over that team and we're gonna let this team win the lottery, what are you going to do? Cry about it? Just sue them? What kind of recourse do you have as a fan to prevent this sort of thing?

Brian Touhy: 24:36

Now, supposedly they have this big ping-pong ball hopper thing now where they can't supposedly quote, unquote, can't be fixed, it can't rig the outcome because of this random way they choose whatever team. But guess what? It's like a magic trick. Sure, you can. Of course you can rig it if you want to rig it. Do they want to rig it every year, not saying that they do Certain years? Do they want to rig it? I think they definitely do and I think, again, they have the control and ability to do so. And, especially, they don't make it now. They don't even make it public. They have a couple of trusted journalists that are in the room to watch what happens. Yeah, ok, sure, trust the journalists here. You guys want to keep reporting on the NBA and not lose your access to the locker rooms and to all the inside information we ditch out. Guess what You'll do? Exactly what we say. You'll tell the fans exactly what we want them to hear, right, right, and that's all it takes.

Tom Higgins: 25:28

Wow, do you feel like basketball is probably the easiest team sport to rig through officiating? I mean, one player could make a massive difference in basketball on a team and just the calls that they make at the right moments could completely shift the momentum of a game versus like. Obviously the officials could rig any game with their calls, but to me it seems like basketball might be one of the easiest team sports to kind of get the result they want.

Brian Touhy: 25:54

Well, I think I would agree with you because it is almost like football. It is a game where almost every play, every possession, potentially the refs could call a penalty on. I mean, traveling is ubiquitous through the whole NBA. If you guys travel all the time, they rarely call it, but every once in a while they do call it. Was that a charge or was that a block? Which way does the referee want to lean? Which team does he want to favor? I mean, there's a lot of ways that they can tweak these things, especially for point-shaving purposes, for gambling purposes, but for the outright outcome of the game, yeah, there's a lot of ways they can tweak it, and you hear players even talk about it. Of course, you can't talk about it as a player, you get fined, but at the same time you hear players talk about it. Well, we not only had to beat the five guys on the court, we had to beat the other three who were officiating the game. You hear that because they know. They know that certain referees lean certain ways and want certain teams to do better.

Brian Touhy: 26:48

One thing about the NBA is the NBA proves basically what I've written about for all this time and that game tanking is a real thing in the NBA. For some reason, the press just lets it go on an X like it doesn't happen. That's no big deal. But you literally had Mark Cuban, the owner of the Dallas Mavericks, twice in two different seasons, publicly say I told my team it's in the best interest to Loups. And so you had an owner of the team basically funneled this information through his GM, through his head coach, to the players, told them don't win basketball games, we need a better draft pick.

Brian Touhy: 27:28

And if that's not exactly what I'm talking about in terms of fixing games and rigging games, I don't know what else is. I mean, that's the proof. And if they can do that in a regular season game, we could say, well, those games don't matter. Well then, what games really do matter? If regular season games don't matter, do really all playoff games matter? Or could they say, hey look, we want this to go. Instead of a four game sweep, we like it to go to six or seven games, because we're going to sell more tickets, more hot dogs, more parking, more t-shirts, more whatever, and maybe we'd take a couple of playoff games, take a couple of games in the finals. I mean, what games then matter? But that proves my point 100%, and I've had five hand I mean journalists argue this with me like oh, it doesn't Like. What else do you call them if they're not fixed games? If an owner is still on the team to lose, it's a fixed game, straight up.

Mike Straus: 28:16

Yeah, I mean, what are you going to do? Go against your? Owner and not have a job Come next week. Yeah, I mean, you don't not really much of a choice, one of the things that kind of blew my mind. Tom is really big into like numerology and he brought up this crazy. I guess you could say I'm with you. I don't believe in coincidences either, but maybe you can call it that. Tom, why don't you tell them this crazy thing with the number 38?

Tom Higgins: 28:43

Yeah, so I'm no expert on it, but we, this being a conspiracy show, we go pretty deep into the conspiracies and this guy who that is his speciality is numerology Last season posted this about LeBron. So I'll kind of sum this up here and this is just too much coincidence. I try to, you know, use this as a glaring example to try and show people like nah, sports are manipulated, they're rigged, but this is like another level of it. So last year LeBron was about to break Karim's record after 38 years. Lebron was 38 years old during that. It was the 38th day of the year where he was having the game where he was going to attempt it, which was 308 days after the 38th year anniversary. To break that record, lebron would have surpassed 38,388 career points. And then, to follow up, that guy said wild guess, says he scores 38 points. How many points you think LeBron scored that game?

Brian Touhy: 29:46

Come on 38. 38, yeah.

Tom Higgins: 29:49

And then the guy added after that, after the game, after the fact he said wanted to add that Karim set the record in the 38th NBA season and LeBron was born 38 weeks after that record was set. Unreal.

Mike Straus: 30:03

No, that's a little little much Is that just a case, and like, of looking into things way too much and trying to find, you know, coincidences where there really isn't any, or is there I think, I don't know man, that kind of sounds like like you said. That's a little much.

Brian Touhy: 30:21

It is a little much and it's hard to say. I mean I'm not the guy I know there's a lot of people into. It was called Jamantria or whatever. Yeah, jamantria. I mean, I used to be good at math back in high school. It's been a long time since high school so I don't think I'm that good at math anymore, but it seems to me like a lot of times with those things they're cherry picking numbers and cherry picking. You know what gets divided by what or what gets multiplied or added, or we pick these numbers but not those numbers to get to some kind of contrived result, at least in my opinion, and I know some people supposedly have been able to predict certain things that happened based off those numbers. I haven't looked into it enough to say one way or the other, but you know there are certain like, say, coincidences that seem just way too coincidental to be actual coincidences and not like a pre-programmed idea that they're trying to get across.

Mike Straus: 31:11

For sure, for sure, but we get into some MMA and some UFC questions. One last football question I wanted to ask you about. There is a group of people who believe that, well, first off, a few years ago, they put this rule in play where they have separate footballs for field goals, I guess now right and there's a group of people that believe that maybe there's some kind of magnetic device or something in these footballs where they can turn them on and then make the field goal swerve to the left or to the right, Like we had just saw this last weekend.

Mike Straus: 31:50

Buffalo wide right and it kind of looked like the ball made a very abrupt right turn. Do you think there's anything to that at all? Do you think that they're doctoring these field goal balls at all?

Brian Touhy: 32:02

I kind of almost think I started that idea. To be honest, I could be wrong, I could be taking credit where credit is not due. But I talked to and this was I can't even tell you how long ago a guy who used to be a ball boy for the Chicago Bulls and he told me he goes, you know, there's magnets in the basketballs. And I said what he said yeah, there's magnets in the basketballs. And I said what are you talking about? He goes. Well, they have the balls magnetized and the hoop magnetized, so when the ball goes through, it automatically resets the shot clock. I said I don't know about that man, he goes, yeah, and he goes. Then you can also push and pull the ball away from the basket. If they wanted a ball to go in or stay out. I said whoa.

Brian Touhy: 32:48

And then I started thinking about it, because there is, if you go online and research it, there is technology that you can't do that with. You can't put magnets in like footballs that have a magnetized glove, and you can make one hand. It catches all day long and it's a real thing. So you can actually buy if you want to. You can find it online and buy it. And I started thinking about it and I said well, you know the hoop on a basketball, the hoop is metal, the uprights and you know goalposts and the NFL and college are metal, the net and the hockey thing, the poles are metal.

Brian Touhy: 33:21

And I said if all that stuff's metal, the magnetized, and then you had a magnet inside the puck, the football, the basketball, what have you? Could you create a strong enough force to push or pull you know the puck, the football, the basketball, in or out of the goal if you wanted to? And I don't know, you know the scientific facts behind it. I don't know how much of a field you'd have to generate, but could you create one that would potentially swerve something out of the way? I think it's a very real possibility.

Brian Touhy: 33:51

And if they have the ability to put that in a football, then they have the ability to put it in a basketball. They certainly have the ability to put it in a frozen puck. Because if they used to have, you know, those little microchips in the puck for on television back in the days of Fox in the nineties, they had that, you know, was it streak that would follow the puck to make the puck more watchable on television? Oh yeah, who's to say they can't do that? Who's to say it hasn't happened? I mean, I don't necessarily believe it is, but in the realm of conspiracy theories I don't think it's crazy to think it.

Mike Straus: 34:23

No, that's not too far-fetched at all At all. Yeah, I think there might be something to it. To be honest with you, I definitely think there's something to it.

Brian Touhy: 34:31

There's definitely been. I know there's a famous hockey clip, I think quick, I think used to goalie for the Kings, where puck went right through to five-hole, right between his legs and about six inches before it got the goal line. It made a 90 degree turn and did not go into the net and nobody's ever been able to explain how that was possible. But maybe that was a test of the system. You know, a test of the emergency broadcast system. That was it. But you've seen a lot of, we've seen a lot of. You know some weird shots the Kyrie Irvin basket where you just kind of chucked it up from the corner and bounced and then it still went in. Maybe that was pulled in. You know we've seen enough field goals where they're looking like they're going in and, like you say, make right or left-hand turns, midair. That makes you wonder.

Tom Higgins: 35:16

I think so. I've seen a clip of you know how basketball games to like in the halftime or before the game or whatever they'll give the fans a chance to make, like a half court shot or a free throw for money. There was one where the guy did it and the ball got stuck directly on the like dead center of the rim in the in the backboard. It wasn't like wedged on the side like how you see where the ball will get stuck. Like anyone who's played basketball has gotten the ball stuck like wedged between the backboard and the rim, but no, it was dead center on that little like I don't know like two inch flat part between the, the very center of the rim and the backboard. And there was no bounce, there was no nothing. Boom got stuck dead center right there. I don't think that that's possible at all. There's no way it wouldn't have bounced off or yeah, that looked extremely suspicious, like a magnet was just holding it in place.

Brian Touhy: 36:06

Yeah, you like to know the physics behind it. Like, how is that possible?

Mike Straus: 36:10

Yeah.

Brian Touhy: 36:11

I don't think I've ever seen it.

Mike Straus: 36:13

I don't think there is science behind that. They could explain it legitimately, you know.

Brian Touhy: 36:17

But do you have some sort of science? What kind of science is question?

Mike Straus: 36:21

Yeah right, it depends on the expert that you're going with.

Brian Touhy: 36:24

Yeah.

Mike Straus: 36:25

The UFC MMA. I heard you say that. That yeah, that that is no different, you know, than any other sport. That is, that's fixed. Do you think that comes mostly when the fights are fixed? Do you think that it's more so the fighters or the referees, or the judges?

Brian Touhy: 36:41

Well, if you look at the history of boxing, it's all three. So take your pick. It depending on the fight, depending who's fixing it, why they're fixing it. The history of boxing, 100 plus your history of boxing, you've had all of it. You've had judges that were bribed, you'd have referees that are bribed, you've had, you know, fighters that are bribed, and then you can do it with any one of the three. Now, granted, having a judge won't help you if a guy gets knocked out. Referee might not help you too much if a guy gets knocked out, but it has and it can be done through any one of those three individuals involved in the fight.

Mike Straus: 37:17

We just had a recent example of this, too, in the UFC with James Krause and his group of fighters. And and um, you had like a Patreon for gambling yeah exactly when people, would you know, would go and pay him for this gambling advice. But and then you know, one of his fighters supposedly was fixing a fight by going down. And did you hear about the James Krause circle?

Brian Touhy: 37:39

No, that one, I don't, at least if I did, it doesn't bring a bell at the moment.

Mike Straus: 37:43

Yeah, I think. Oh, I want to say it was maybe last year that he got totally banned from the UFC. Jim, his, any fighter that was even associated with his gym is banned from competing in the UFC and because of him now fighters in the UFC can no longer bet on fights, because of I remember that now that you say that part yeah.

Tom Higgins: 38:07

So what it was? The betting line changed like dramatically like within 24 hours of the fight. Because I guess a guy was going into a fight, like highly injured, so he knew he wasn't going to win. And his coach was running like a big betting scheme and like was making money by giving these pick advices to people. So somewhere along the line they were like wait, so don't, don't pull out of the fight, you'll, you'll still make money. Like I can guarantee you money. If you just go in, you lose. Like we'll get people to bet against you.

Tom Higgins: 38:37

And the guy in the fight went out and he took a kick, or he threw a kick, and then he pretended like the kick hurt his leg and then he went down. And I guess the UFC was suspicious because the betting line just got flooded. It was like a random prelim fight that didn't really matter either. And a bunch of people started picking like okay, round one finish against this guy. And then he goes out there and gives a very suspect performance where he kicks with his own injured leg and then takes a dive. And yeah, that's, that's what resulted in that. And now no one wants to be affiliated with James Krause.

Brian Touhy: 39:10

Yeah Well, that's, that's the stupid way of doing it, that's the that's the way you get caught, that's the way of doing it. I mean, that's what happens. You know, in tennis a lot, because tennis is fixed all the time all over the world and a lot of times the people that they've caught fixing tennis started. You know the person who's 179th ranked in the world, playing whoever's you know ranked 181st in the world, and yet there'll be, you know, a $500 bet on the first set. Let's say it'll be like $20,000 bet on game two of the second set and only $500 bet on the third set. And, lo and behold, something weird happened. Some game two of the second set where the $10,000 was bet and people start going hmm, I wonder if something went on there.

Brian Touhy: 39:52

You know, that's the same kind of thing with that fight. You know some prelim fight that nobody cares about and there's all this money flooding in on one side over the other. It's enough to raise suspicions. I mean, that's that's not the way of doing things If you want to get away with it.

Tom Higgins: 40:07

I think that matchmaking is obviously a way that you could argue their. Their fixing things are kind of like building up a star and a guy's career and change the trajectory of you know they're exactly.

Brian Touhy: 40:19

I mean, have you ever heard of a guy named Charles Forell? Uh, the name for boxing, not for UFC boxing.

Mike Straus: 40:25

The name sounds familiar, but I don't know if I can't put a face to him.

Brian Touhy: 40:28

Well, charles Forell, he managed a five different world champions throughout their career. Okay, so I mean he was in the fight game a long time. You knew a lot of people in the fight game, whatever, and I don't even remember how he ran into the guy, how he met him, but long story short, he basically told me he's fixed hundreds of fights, hundreds, and he knows of other managers, trainers, who have fixed an equal amount of fights. Fights are fixed all the time, boxing matches all the time. And when he explained it to me and I'll explain it here it makes perfect sense as to why it's, like he said, to build up a fighter. So basically he said, trainers, managers, if they've been around long enough in the fight game, they recognize talent really fast, really fast. They can tell this guy's got it, this other guy doesn't have it. If they have a guy who they think really is talented, really has it, they don't want to see that guy get beat up on his way to a potential championship fight. So what they do is they take this fighter, this up and coming fighter, and basically go to another manager who has their own stable of pelucas, just average ordinary fighters, and they say, hey look, my guy basically threw their little code talking but basically says hey look, my guy needs three rounds of work.

Brian Touhy: 41:46

You got somebody who gave me three rounds of work and he says, yes, they fight, the up and coming fighter wins in the third round with a knockout and the career goes on. And that's why a lot of times it's actually boxing. You'll see a guy do a championship fight, you'll be 22 and 0 with 20 knockouts. Well, chances are those 20 knockouts were all fixed fights. The guy really only fought like two real fights which he didn't knock anybody out in, and now he's in the title fight and so all those matches were fixed along the line to build this guy up, to get him to the title fight, which is the only fight that matters. He's gotten work, he's gotten training, but he hasn't been injured on his way up to the title and that's the way things really work in boxing.

Mike Straus: 42:26

Wow, and it's probably the same in mixed martial arts, the UFC. I'm sure, yeah, and when do you think?

Brian Touhy: 42:32

about it 100%.

Mike Straus: 42:33

For sure, and when you think about it, it's not out of the realm of possibility for managers to fix fights without even the fighter really consciously knowing that they're being had too right.

Brian Touhy: 42:48

Well, exactly. And the thing is, it makes sense. I mean, it makes perfect sense if you stop to think about it, if you step back away from the fact of saying, oh my God, this fight's fixed. It makes perfect sense what they're doing. But yeah, exactly, the fighter, the up-and-coming fighter, he probably has zero clue. In fact you don't want him to know because that might affect his whole mental game, mental aspect of the fight game, and he might just think well, he's a bulldozer because he's gotten through 20 fighters with 20 knockouts. But it's probably all set up. And it's funny too, because actually in I think it's Rocky III if everybody's a Rocky fan at pretty sure it's in the third Rocky fight before Mickey dies, he actually tells Rocky that he set up number of fights for him while he was champion to make sure that Rocky stayed champion. It's kind of funny. It's actually in the movie Wow.

Brian Touhy: 43:37

And he brings that up. But I mean it's a real thing and I can say I'm sure it happens in the UFC and the MMA, because it's the same thing, it's the same realm, it's the same fight game. It's just a different style of fighting, but again, it makes sense. Do you really want an MMA fighter on his way to a potential championship get beat up time and time and time again before he gets to that championship fight, or do you want him fresh and feeling strong and thinking he's a world beater, going into that title fight? Which would you prefer?

Mike Straus: 44:09

Yeah, I believe we just saw something like that this last weekend in the UFC. So you had a middleweight title match with the current champion, or then he was the current champion, sean Strickland, and he was defending his title against Dracus Duplisise, a South African fighter who had previously had a lot of beef with the champion before Sean Strickland. Again, make a long story short, sean Strickland lost his title via a very close, controversial split decision loss. Personally, I believe he won, but now that sets up this dream fight that has been hyped and talked about for months and months and months Israel Adesanya versus Dracus Duplisise. Funny how things work out. Oh, and, by the way, they're talking about making that fight at UFC 300, the biggest event ever.

Brian Touhy: 45:07

Yeah, see, it's just luck, right Luck for UFC and Dana White and the rest of them. And the thing is what I don't think a lot of people don't consider is that, again, if you look at the history boxing, it's been so incredibly fixed over the decades and what they've been able to do and get away with. I mean, in the 1920s, organized crime literally fixed every single fight that Primo Cardera fought to make him a heavyweight championship of the world, including the heavyweight title fight. Every single fight they fixed to make sure he won, because they knew the guy couldn't fight but he looked like he could because he's like six foot six and like 280 pounds, which was just ginormous in the 1920s. And then when they, after he won the heavyweight title, the mob stopped fixing fights the very next fight, but heavily against him, and he got knocked out, lost this heavyweight title and the mob made all kind of money. He flashed forward to the 1950s and there was a guy by the name of Frankie Carbo who was an organized crime cop. In fact he could have been the guy who killed Bugsy Siegel, if you know mob history. But Frankie Carbo literally ran boxing. This organized crime, this mafia guy, literally ran the sport of boxing in the 1950s and he decided who would fight, where they would fight, when they would fight and a lot of times who would win and who would lose.

Brian Touhy: 46:28

And in my one book the fix is still in. I make a comparison between what Frankie Carbo does and what Dana White does and it's very similar how the two operate. We just don't know exactly that. You know, dana White is fixing matches but he is determining who fights who, when they fight, where they fight and that sort of thing. It's just. It's a very interesting comparison between these two areas of what boxing was huge in the 1950s and now, when the UFC is huge today, and what they're capable potentially of doing. Because, let's face it, you know you've got to make big events for these pay-per-view things time and time again. You can't have crappy matchups and pay-per-view. How do you keep getting all these prime matchups? You know, is it just luck? Does it just work out that way, or they orchestrate it all?

Mike Straus: 47:16

Yeah, it's quite fortuitous, you know. Oh totally Anything from Chicago or you know just outside of it. Got to ask you about, you know, the Michael Jordan conspiracy. Do you think that's no conspiracy?

Brian Touhy: 47:32

Yeah, go ahead ask some questions.

Mike Straus: 47:34

Personally, I think he was forced to retire for gambling issues. What do you think?

Brian Touhy: 47:39

I know he was forced to retire for gambling issues. I don't think I know it and I mean another thing. The problem is is people say, well, why can't you prove it? That, unfortunately, I talked to I know a friend who talked to a former bull who basically said, yeah, jordan was kicked out because of gambling. I have a friend whose mother was Jerry Rheinstorff's personal secretary, who's the owner of the bulls, and she was present for numerous meetings between Rheinstorff, stern and Jordan talking about their gambling, talking about his retirement and what they were going to do about it. And I know a woman who had a lengthy affair with Michael Jordan, who confirmed the whole thing Not as long as we'll go on the record, but I know for a fact.

Brian Touhy: 48:23

That's exactly what went down. He was too big and he meant too much money to too many people to go the same route as Pete Rose went just what three, four years earlier. And the NBA couldn't afford it. Nbc couldn't afford it. Mcdonald's, coca-cola, all the other things that Michael Jordan represented, nike yeah, they couldn't afford to lose him like that. So they concocted this whole he's going to retire thing. He's going to go play baseball. It's all going to disappear. And immediately after it happened, the media dropped their investigations, the NBA dropped their investigations and basically everybody forgot about it until he showed back up 18 months later.

Mike Straus: 49:01

People forget that his father, who was murdered when they arrested people in connection with it. These people had, like I don't know if it was the people that killed his father, but there was criminals that were arrested that had checks, personal checks from Michael Jordan in the amount of like $10,000. And Jordan even had to admit, after denying it said yeah, you know it's from gambling. So, yeah, there's no doubt that he was in deep with you know, with who knows who.

Brian Touhy: 49:28

But the wrong kind of people. Well, yeah, one of the guys is one of the guys he got busted gambling with was an old cocaine trafficker, right, that's what I'm thinking of. Yup, he owed him $57,000 and a guy had a $57,000 check that's what I'm thinking of. And he got busted by the IRS. And the guy said his name was Slim Boulder, the Boulder Boulder, I think, was his last name, boulder. He said, well, michael Jordan gave me $57,000 to open a driving range. And that, just having said that Michael Jordan gave me $57,000 to open the driving range, the judge actually said, oh okay, well, that's probably legit that and let it go. And it was like two weeks later they were like wait, wait, a second, wait, wait. You know he had no paperwork to open up a driving range, he had nothing to back it up. And initially the judge is like, oh well, michael Jordan give me the money, okay, no problem. And then they started looking into it again, said wait a second. And then it came out oh no, it was for a gambling debt.

Brian Touhy: 50:25

Then there was a guy named Eddie Dow who was kind of a bail bondsman. Basically he was kind of a shady character. He murdered and they don't even think it actually was a robbery. But in his briefcase they found I think it was, three checks totaling several thousand dollars off of Michael Jordan. That was all related to gambling losses. And then there was another guy on the West Coast that he owed a million dollars to that his wife was writing checks out to because he lost all this money gambling on golf. So I mean he owed money to several people. And those are just the three people we know about. Yeah, I mean who knows who else he had to pay off or paid losing on gambling or who he was associating with during that whole time? But even today everybody's like, oh yeah, well, jordan gambles all the time. Nobody bats an eye at it.

Mike Straus: 51:12

You hear stories like that. He's such a degenerate gambler that he'll flip a coin and bet $30,000 on heads or tails. I mean, it's out of hand. That's crazy.

Brian Touhy: 51:23

Oh, it is. And I mean they knew during his playing days that when the team was on the East Coast playing the Nets or playing the Knicks, that he would go to the Atlantic City before and after the games he played, when they're out, you know, in the Utah playing at the Jazz. Wherever he would travel Las Vegas, you know the nights and days after the game. And I mean he was, he was constantly gambling. So I mean to think that this guy was an end to some shady stuff and that nobody knew about it is insane. I mean, it was a well known thing. It's just a question of how far it went, and I believe, or I'd say I know, it went so far. So the NBA had to shut him down because he was out of control.

Mike Straus: 52:03

I'll tell you you aren't lying about him being the face of the NBA in the 90s. I mean, people forget, or people forget or they don't remember or they weren't around to remember. But I'm 43. I got to live through all the glory years. And let me tell you, in the 90s it wasn't like it is now, where there's four or five, six superstars, you know every, every team's got a no, no, no, no, no, it was Michael Jordan.

Tom Higgins: 52:26

You know, I mean, it was, he was, he was everything.

Mike Straus: 52:29

If he fell, the you're right, the entire NBA and all those other companies I think would have went right, right along with them.

Brian Touhy: 52:35

Oh yeah, I mean he would have taken, he would have taken the league down, the league would have just I don't think it would have collapsed collapsed, but it would have taken a huge hit, way bigger hit the Major League Baseball took with Pete Rose, but even that actually effective Major League Baseball. Just so happened, though, that a couple of years later, you know, sammy Sosa and Mark McGuire started hitting home runs all over the place, and people forgot about the whole Pete Rose scandal. They're literally taking something like that to bring the NBA back after Jordan. If he really went down for his gambling and he should have and I don't even know how they allowed him to become an owner.

Brian Touhy: 53:05

I have no idea how they just ignored it all, but I think he's just too big of a face, too big of a name. It means too much wanting too many people to really knock him down. The not to see should be knocked out. He should be kicked out of the game. He should be kicked out of the game. He should be kicked out of the Hall of Fame and there's other players who should be as well if they were serious about stopping gambling within the sport.

Mike Straus: 53:25

I mean, if Pete Rose was, you know it should be. Everybody should be held to the same standard.

Tom Higgins: 53:31

I agree with the whole billions of dollar industries with sports and it is a business. It's an entertainment business and the whole conspiratorial take on it is it's Roman bread and circus and it's mainly meant to distract and keep the people entertained and give them something to look forward to and be excited about, so that they don't Get passionate about other issues that might be more important. Or it's just another way to keep them fighting amongst each other over Something that really doesn't matter as much, rather than you know other issues like the. The quote by one of the Roman emperors was give them bread and Circuses and they will never revolt. Like just keep them busy with food, beer, gambling games, you know, just constant entertainment. What do you think would be the main objective of controlling sports other than the obvious billions of dollars? Do you think it would be more of a something malevolent like that? Like?

Brian Touhy: 54:27

Oh yeah.

Tom Higgins: 54:27

Siob.

Brian Touhy: 54:29

Oh yeah, I got a hundred percent agree. I mean the Romans weren't dumb, they knew what it took. I mean that's the same today. I mean you know, a lot of people don't even think about how much professional sports are subsidized by the government. I mean teams get you know, the lead. The leagues have, you know, antitrust exemptions. Local governments give them free land, build stadiums for them, give them tax breaks, give them all sorts of things and incentives to stay in a city or move to another city. You know it's not like these owners are really independent when it comes to that, but it is something that they control, games themselves, but it is.

Brian Touhy: 55:06

I mean look how distracted people are, especially by the NFL. I mean the NFL is the most watched television program in the country and the most watched television programs in the history of the United States are all NFL games, are all Super Bowl. So I mean it's it's definitely entertainment, it's definitely television, but it's a great way of distracting people. It's a great way of people getting more, you know, like you see, in tune to other things than the stuff they should be, you know, really worried about and concerned about and paying attention to. I mean look how many people you know, go nuts because they show Taylor Swift at the chiefs game. I mean, who cares? I could care less that she's there, you know. But I mean people get riled up about it and they talk about it and whatever. And you know, does anybody care about what's happening at the border? Does anybody care about what's happening in Washington DC? Or do they care where Taylor Swift is for a football game?

Tom Higgins: 55:57

Honestly, and I think it's pretty telling how they use Roman numerals and a lot of Roman symbolism and stuff for the Super Bowl, and Can you imagine if all these people in the stadiums going nuts were united and that passionate and, like you know, putting their differences aside and just getting behind one cause about something that was more important, like any of the issues you mentioned or who knows how many other things? Other things like it's almost like a religion to some people like that, that's the thing they care about more than anything in the world. Than like when it comes to the NFL, like it's Sunday and they say things like oh, my game day ritual, or even the word fan comes from, like fanatics and it's very, almost like Cultish.

Brian Touhy: 56:40

Oh, and it's. And how much your brain space does it take up? I mean, you know you ask somebody. You know we name the starting lineup of your favorite whatever football team, basketball team, baseball team. They could probably rattle it off. Oh yeah, they say name the. You know the members of Congress who represent your district.

Tom Higgins: 56:59

In the emotions too, I get a ruin your day. People get so angry or so happy. It depends on their team.

Brian Touhy: 57:05

That's why I always hope that the Packers is southern Wisconsin and I just want to see the whole stake get depressed every time they lose.

Mike Straus: 57:14

I hear you. I'm glad they love it.

Brian Touhy: 57:17

Oh my god is the. I slept so soundly Saturday night after they lost. It's great.

Mike Straus: 57:22

How is it being a Bears fan in Wisconsin?

Brian Touhy: 57:25

Oh see, I live right on the border, so it's kind of that mixed thing where some people could be Packer fan and Covus fan at the same time, which doesn't make sense. Right, brewers fans and bear fans. It's just kind of a weird melting pot in that way. But it is it the thing, and that's one of the things I noticed it like with, like, say, with being in Wisconsin, this Packer fandom thing. It just shows how much you can take over.

Brian Touhy: 57:48

Uh, you know a state really. I mean it really does, because I mean, when the Packers are good and this year didn't really count but back in the day, you know, when they were on the playoff march you would get to the nightly news, the 10 o'clock news, and the first story would be about the Packers. The second story would be about the Packers. The third story would be about you know how some guys shot five people and killed three of them. Then they would go to another Packer story. Then the weather would be about the Packers game coming up on Sunday. Then there was sports and that was like the 10 o'clock newscast. It was like, um, yeah, there was other things that went on in the world, but all they cared about was the Packers and it's like oh my god, that's why, like I say, I just I want them to lose every game, because I can't stand listening to that, because, again, it's so many people in Wisconsin are so Gun-ho about it that, you know, nothing else seems to matter to them.

Tom Higgins: 58:36

Now, what's it been like to watch sports with this mentality that you've had For the longest time doing this research and stuff? Does it feel like you're more and more so watching WWE? Or like just trying to decode and like see what they're trying to? You know which narrative they're trying to push?

Brian Touhy: 58:51

If you take your fan handoff and watch any sport, whatever sport it is that you like the most, if you take the fan handoff and watch it objectively, it completely changes how you consume how you consume the games or the fights or whatever, because you do start noticing things you never really noticed before. And I don't watch sports Nearly like I used to 20 years ago. I mean I can't, I don't, I don't find them interesting, I don't find them entertaining, I get bored by them. I mean I could still go to like a baseball game, I could go see a hockey game, I could watch a football game, but I can't do it non-stop every night, every weekend, what have you? I just can't. Because it is like I say to me I see right through it all and you could just tell I mean, like the Packer game, when Packer 49er game, I knew the 49ers were gonna win that game, I knew it was over. Before it was over. I mean I saw it like the writing was on the wall, I saw what was gonna happen, I could feel it come. And I mean same thing with, like the Ravens I knew there was no way to Ravens. I mean there's certain things that you can just tell. By the hype, by the story lines, by how the certain games start to play out, you can just tell how it's gonna go, I mean.

Brian Touhy: 59:58

But you have to be willing, like I say, to not be a fan and watch it as a rational person. And it's a hard thing to do because there's a lot of times where I've talked to people about this and a lot of times people say I ruin sports for them. But I could talk to somebody who's like an NBA fan and I'll talk to them and say, hey, you know, the NFL does this, the NFL does. That's been the big games. That will be 100% with me. And then I'll say, but and then the NBA? When they do it, and people are like whoa, no, no, no, no, they don't do that basketball, that's not my sport, not my sport, not my team. It's an instant pushback because it is partially psychological. It's kind of like a drug for a lot of people and you can't start telling them Santa Claus isn't real, because it really messes with them.

Tom Higgins: 1:00:42

Yeah, that was like when I first found out WWE and pro wrestling was fake. Like no, it's not. They take chair shots and they get slammed. How could that be fake?

Brian Touhy: 1:00:51

How could it not be fake? Think about it.

Mike Straus: 1:00:54

Yeah right, that's. That's the real question. I was just taking a look here at your website, which is thefixisinnet, which is just a great resource, and, as well as you could find a lot of your work, or all of your work, in books. They're two signed books, so everybody should check that out. One of the cool things I was looking at here was you have the top 10 fixes, the games, and then the streaks and number eight. Right here is Ronda Rousey's UFC career. I just I think that's very apropos.

Brian Touhy: 1:01:25

Well, I think it was all orchestrated.

Mike Straus: 1:01:28

Yeah, going back to making a fighter's path a little bit easier by picking and choosing their opponents right.

Brian Touhy: 1:01:34

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I mean I'm not saying it's like a lot of this stuff I'm not seeing like she wasn't talented, I'm sure she could kick my ass right now and good, back in the day, I wouldn't deny that one bit. And it's the same with, like you know, certain athletes like LeBron and Jordan, and you know Aaron Rodgers and you know Lamar Jackson stuff. You can't fake talent and are certainly guys out there who are way more talented than even our contemporaries that they're playing against. And you could see it. And it's obvious.

Brian Touhy: 1:02:01

And I think you know the leagues aren't stupid. They know those superstars exist and they just basically say to the officials like, look, you create a bubble around a guy like LeBron James where you basically you can't defend them like you defend other players because they're going to call a foul on you. It gives them a little more room to operate. They're going to do better, they're going to score more points, they're going to win more games, they're going to get to the playoffs more during the finals more, potentially win championships more. But that's not bad for the league If one guy dominates like that, if a Tom Brady dominates like that, because you know what Everybody in the league is benefitting from that. I mean, with so much revenue shared amongst the teams and coming from the broadcast rights from the major media outlets, everybody wins. So I mean to create those bubbles around those star athletes to allow them to almost overachieve. Because of the bubbles, it makes perfect business sense. Why wouldn't you do that if you ran such a business?

Mike Straus: 1:02:58

Yeah, that's why Vince McMahon didn't want to get into the UFC business, because he couldn't determine the outcomes. So yeah, the last thing. The last thing I wanted to ask you about, brian, if you don't mind, is one of probably the most widely accepted. The most widely accepted fixed game is Super Bowl three. Would you agree with that and, if so, could you? Can you lay it out there on just why people think that is probably the most fixed game ever?

Brian Touhy: 1:03:26

I don't know if it's most widely accepted, but top five, yeah, I mean. Well, for people who look into this, yeah, and if they like history, because a lot of younger guys don't even realize Super Bowl went on back in the 60s, you know right, but no, but basically what it was is it came down to what people? Again, you have to know a little bit of history of football is. There's two rival football leagues. I mean there was the AFL and the NFL and it wasn't like the NFL and the XFL or the USFL or what's the new one, the UFL. Now they made it into, they were they were pretty much legit rival leagues where they would fight over, you know, the star players coming out of college and it was costing everybody money.

Brian Touhy: 1:04:07

So the leagues decided to merge. The only problem was is that the NFL fans outnumbered AFL fans, probably at least three or four to one. And it's funny, the AFL brand of football was seen as inferior, despite the fact that it actually most mimics today's football league, because there's a lot of passing and a lot of receiving, a lot of high scoring. But a lot of fans weren't receptive receptive, I should say, to the AFL and their style of football. So when the leagues decided to merge and created the Super Bowl, fans were very skeptical.

Brian Touhy: 1:04:39

And then, after Super Bowl one, super Bowl two were the Packers killed the Chiefs and the Raiders.

Brian Touhy: 1:04:44

Nfl fans were really like this league's going to suck when they add all these new teams in.

Brian Touhy: 1:04:49

And so here came Super Bowl three and the NFL is represented by the Baltimore Colts, which is literally one of the best teams in football history to this day. I think they had the biggest point differentials, like 18, some odd points, a game which was only recently beaten by the Patriots a couple of years ago, but it's like the second most point differential per game of any team in NFL history. And they were playing the Jets, who finished third in the AFL, and everybody assumed the Colts were just going to blow them out. It was going to be another terrible game like the other Super Bowls, and now the merger was really brazen down their growth, and so a lot of people believe me among them, that the NFL fixed the game and made the Colts take a dive to allow the Jets to win, and it basically created the modern NFL based off that one game, because it solidified the merger, solidified the fan base and it meant Billions of dollars to the guys who won the league.

Mike Straus: 1:05:43

Boy, I'll tell you. You know, it sure does look like it was fixed if you go back and you watch. What was the quarterbacks name for the Colts Earl moral boy was the MVP of the league that year. Well, not that game. No they said they were in the red zone, I think what. Four or five times, and three times they came away with interceptions or something like that. I mean, yeah, they never they never scored in the red zone.

Brian Touhy: 1:06:06

There's like three interceptions, like a missed field will or something like that. Well, it's interesting too because the three I think the three main people who might have been involved in fixing it were the Colts owner, their head coach and borrell who was the quarterback. Now the owner was Kale Rosenbloom. He wound up getting three million dollars for the NFL for his team to switch to the what became the AFC, the AFL teams. That's how the Colts wound up in the AFC and two years later they won Super Bowl five. Another quarterback in Super Bowl five for the Colts happen to be a Earl moral, so he got a Super Bowl title Just took two years later.

Brian Touhy: 1:06:41

Rosenbloom will in the Colts got his Super Bowl title two years later and the head coach for the Colts that At that time was Don Shulup, who immediately after season signed a huge deal with the Miami Dolphins and then, three years later, led the team that was undefeated and it remains undefeated to this day the old NFL team, the Miami Dolphins. So everybody who was involved in fixing that game, in my opinion all got rewarded greatly For doing so, wow, obviously, the 85 Bears were one of the best teams ever.

Mike Straus: 1:07:12

They had the one loss against Miami.

Tom Higgins: 1:07:14

Do you?

Mike Straus: 1:07:15

think there's something to that to preserve Miami being the only team to go undefeated.

Brian Touhy: 1:07:20

It's funny. I remember that Monday night football game against the Dolphins, but I don't remember exactly what happened. But it wouldn't surprise. I mean seems very strange that no team has ever gone undefeated Since 1972. I mean that's kind of bizarre because it's there's been a lot of teams have been close, very close. I mean the, you know Patriots a couple years ago made it all the way to Super Bowl before they lost being undefeated.

Mike Straus: 1:07:42

But it is kind of interesting that that's remained a thing first, long as it has well, dude, this was a, this was fun, this was, this was awesome, and I appreciate you doing this so much.

Brian Touhy: 1:07:53

Oh, no problem, Happy to talk to you guys.

Tom Higgins: 1:07:55

Yeah, great episode. Can't wait to share it with all my sports fanatic friends and they'll say I'm just nuts Talking nonsense.

Brian Touhy: 1:08:02

It's the way it goes.

Tom Higgins: 1:08:03

Well, that's the reaction we're used to anyway.

Brian Touhy: 1:08:05

so trust me, so am I, doesn't faze me one bit like say. It all comes down to Basically two things is one, realizing that there's no law that prevents a league from fixing its own game and so many times it's in our best business decision to have certain outcomes happen over other outcomes and to just watch games, like I say, without your fanhand on. Watch them objectively when you have no rooting interest. And then tell me that the certain things just aren't highly, highly suspect. And if you question why, I think you come to the conclusion that I came to a long time ago is that it's being controlled for good reasons. Money, it's always money, right, always, always. Way the world works what is encrypted by money? Amazing, that's the funny thing. You know, business is corrupted by money, governments corrupted by money, even religions are corrupted by money. But sports fans think sports can't be corrupted by money. Yeah right, that's so. It's so absurd that somehow Professional sports is pure. Well, you had everything else in the world's corrupt.

Tom Higgins: 1:09:11

I recently have started a Wrestling league where I'm basically the Vince McMahon and I host matches and put matches on. And now this is. This got my head kind of Spinning. Am I gonna get corrupted? Am I? Am I gonna start rigging fights?

Mike Straus: 1:09:23

Well, you're more like the Dana White, because you're you're not fixing fights yet yeah yeah, right.

Tom Higgins: 1:09:30

Yeah, but maybe if someone wants to throw me a few billion to rig some matches will be. We'll be talking different.

Mike Straus: 1:09:37

Yeah, a billion, with a big it's all it takes.

Brian Touhy: 1:09:40

It's all it takes you. It's sad. I mean I was on this show, radio show, with John Richie, who is the fullback for the Oakland Raiders, when they went to the Super Bowl and lost the Tampa Bay Buccaneers and I don't think I asked when I think the other host is called, was asked me like you know, john, would you fix a game for you know enough money? And he actually didn't say no, blew my mind. He was actually well, they gave me enough money. Yeah, maybe I was just like okay, thanks for my point, dude, I don't need to be on this show anymore.

Mike Straus: 1:10:14

Yeah, the honesty to you.

Brian Touhy: 1:10:15

Gotta appreciate the honesty you know yeah, but it was funny that he didn't. I mean, the easiest thing to say is no, oh god, no, I went to it, but he didn't. You actually said, well, no, man, maybe I would that's an interesting Super Bowl too.

Mike Straus: 1:10:27

You know what the home, the Barrett Robin situation, yeah, that's that one was totally rigged to.

Tom Higgins: 1:10:32

Yeah, yeah the whole excited to see if we get the 49ers versus Ravens narrative after all or if the NFL is scrambling to change the script.

Brian Touhy: 1:10:39

The act that they might want Taylor Swift in the house. So yeah, that's what I'd be worried if I was the Raven.

Mike Straus: 1:10:44

Ravens got a win by like 400 points this weekend to make sure that the rescue Interfered yeah, yeah, it's kind of seemed like this whole season has an undertone storyline of Taylor Swift to it. So I think you're, you think you're on to something there. So mention you, you got.

Brian Touhy: 1:11:02

Gary.

Mike Straus: 1:11:02

I know, right. Did you see that stupid dance that she had everybody doing? Oh my god, yeah, come on.

Brian Touhy: 1:11:07

Yeah, stay out of football.

Mike Straus: 1:11:09

You know, stay out the the fixes in net. That's your website. You're also at the fixes in. Do you have any other projects or anything else you'd like to shout out?

Brian Touhy: 1:11:21

No, that's that's place people can find me, and if they want to contact me, feel free to email me. I always respond to him.

Tom Higgins: 1:11:27

So that was Brian Tui great guy, super cool. I love his work. Like I said, can't wait to share this one with my family and friends who are. They're massive sports heads and you know he doesn't sound like a nut job or Talk to crazy like some of the people that we talked to on this show, so I think he lends his argument well.

Mike Straus: 1:11:48

Yeah for sure. Yeah, it's what he said too, when you said you were gonna play it too, or you know, if you were gonna share this episode with a lot of your sports friends, your friends that appreciate sports. He said, oh yeah, they got a wax job. But no, no, I don't, I don't think so. He didn't sound like a wax job at all and yeah, that was a, that was a good one man. I really it doesn't ruin sports for me, but it makes me, as he said, it kind of makes me View sports through a different lens. You know, and all sports I'm not just talking about, like football and basketball, I'm even talking about the UFC, mixed martial arts, boxing.

Tom Higgins: 1:12:28

I'm talking about everything, dude, definitely and, uh, I'm pretty much open to anything and everything being ruined. For me at this point nowadays, like I've had my paradigms and beliefs shattered and challenged so many times, so really nothing. I can't, can't count out anything being, you know, controlled or malevolent or whatever it may be. I will say I, when I was first getting into MMA back in the day, one of the first fights Maybe the very first fight I ever watched go down live, I still remember it was UFC 75. So maybe not the first one I ever saw live, but it was a free card UFC 75, and it was in England. It was Bispin versus Matt Hamill.

Mike Straus: 1:13:09

Oh yeah.

Tom Higgins: 1:13:10

Matt Hamill beat the shit out of him and I remember just like I was like, oh, this guy's a wrestler, he's deaf. Like I kind of like felt bad for him. I wanted to root for him because he was deaf, like oh, the underdog story. And he like let's go. And he beat the shit out of him and Bispin like had nothing to offer and in the post fight thing they gave the decision to Bispin and in the post fight, like highlights, the only thing they were able to show was Bispin sprawling like one take down. Even though he was taken down and controlled like the whole fight he was. He went crazy.

Tom Higgins: 1:13:37

He was shocked when he found out he won that fight because everyone knew like that to me was like one of the most obvious Examples and first examples of like completely fixed fights. But they're like oh, don't worry, the the two judges who picked Bispin was American and the one judge that picked against him was English. I was like, oh yeah, that's what a convenient cover story for that. But yeah, I mean he's just confirming everything that I've always kind of thought with his Work and his arguments on why and how these things would be fixed, like it's kind of just stuff We've always suspected.

Tom Higgins: 1:14:05

Like even the untrained eye can be like okay, yeah, they're, they're protecting Tom Brady, or they're, they're giving these calls to this team because he's the star of the league, or you know, it's pretty compelling when you put all his work together to his work.

Mike Straus: 1:14:19

Super compelling, but Matt Hamill. So you're right, it was UFC 75 champion vs Champion.

Tom Higgins: 1:14:28

Dan Henderson, and Rampage was the main event right.

Mike Straus: 1:14:30

Yes, you are correct, and Crocop and Congo was on there too. Yeah, bispin vs Hamill, it was a split decision and it was the co-main event. You're right about all of that. What I find crazy is Matt Hamill was also involved in the only blemish on John Jones's record. So John Jones has the one, no contest, and that was from a fight. I remember watching this fight live when it happened.

Tom Higgins: 1:15:02

It was when he was getting killed, he was getting killed.

Mike Straus: 1:15:04

Oh he was destroying. It was when John Jones was still a pretty much an unknown guy on the prelims and he beat the brakes off Matt Hamill. But what had happened was he had used a 12 to 6 elbow and and even though it really didn't cause damage, that isn't illegal elbow. So that is why the fight got turned into a no contest. But yeah. That I heard that rule is changing or has changed. So that's good, because that's some bullshit.

Tom Higgins: 1:15:34

Yeah, I would like to see that rule change and I'm glad that Matt Hamill has the blemish on that, because I hate John Jones. I think he's a piece of shit. I've never really liked him. I mean, when he was coming up it was a little easier to like him. But everything that has happened with him and he's had a couple of decisions that arguably should have lost that went his way and I never really liked him. And then Matt Hamill got robbed by Bissping, so it is funny that he Got awarded that shitty fucking win over John Jones. But hey, I'm, I'm all for it.

Mike Straus: 1:16:02

Yeah the only good thing is Matt Hamill couldn't hear how he got fucked, you know.

Tom Higgins: 1:16:09

I as, like I said, with running wrestling wars now the the whole fixes in type of deal I could. I could honestly see so much from the inside, like when I'm trying to put matchups together, like one of the main things I focused on is trying to make fair matches, because I don't want somebody to feel like, oh fuck, like you know I got fucked, like was Tom trying to, you know, get me beat or favor someone else, and I tried to make sure every match that I've put together so far was, you know, competitive and evenly matched. Or, you know nobody was mismatched and just totally outclassed and I think I've done a good job of that so far. But uh, hey, someone wants to throw me some millions and billions. We could talk.

Mike Straus: 1:16:51

Yeah right, touching on the the 12 to 6 elbow. Do you know why that elbow is illegal?

Tom Higgins: 1:16:57

Some goofball boxing commissioner said I've seen guys break boards and break ice with that elbow like there. We can't let them do that to somebody.

Mike Straus: 1:17:05

Yeah, you're right, that's exactly it. Yeah, it's some fucking. Some. Jim oak was up at three in the morning watching those infomercials about some bogus karate guy breaking fucking blocks of ice with his 12 to 6 elbow and and, yeah, now you can't do that because of that asshole saw that, when in reality you can generate much more power by throwing like a 93,. You know like, yeah, yeah, I it, just it doesn't make any fucking sense. Yeah, john McCarthy tells that story and I just think it's so fucking silly.

Tom Higgins: 1:17:36

Like these guys know nothing 12 to 6 elbow while being on top of someone is, honestly, it seems like one of the least efficient strikes you could throw, like yeah, so many other directions that you could throw.

Tom Higgins: 1:17:49

That elbow is A lot harder and if you don't know what we're talking about, if you're listening, pick the set called a 12 to 6 elbow, because it's you're bringing your elbow straight up from the ceiling and straight down onto the guy. But what's funny is if you throw an elbow at any other angle, like if you're, you're on your back and the guy's on top of you and you're throwing the exact same strike from your, from your back, from the perspective of your back, it would be a 12 to 6 elbow. But I guess, since you're not vertical and say you're, you know the guys on top you, he's in your guard and your elbowing him on the top of the head, it's the exact same strike. I'm sure you don't have gravity on your side, but it then becomes like a. What would you call it then? Like a three, yeah, three to nine elbow or yeah, or to 10 elbow, and there's so many strikes that could destroy someone, like grabbing the back of someone's head, pulling it down and throwing a knee.

Tom Higgins: 1:18:39

Oh yeah like that's way more devastating than a short elbow from the ground where you don't have a lot of room to wind up and the strike that they were talking about to begin with, the breaking the boards and the you know the ice and stuff. They're standing straight up. They're basically like jumping and dropping their whole weight down. I'm probably pre-cut for pre-broken boards. Like that strike is just not gonna happen. Sure, if you blasted someone in the eye with that, you're gonna do some damage. But realistically, like, even look back to the old UFC days or Leagues where maybe that rule isn't legal, or even just like street fights or whatever. You're not gonna see people getting devastated by that straight down elbow strike on top. There's just a lot better options to do damage.

Mike Straus: 1:19:21

There's a lot of trick re-involved to when you see somebody do that. They've you know, they've done that thousands of times. There's a technique, there's a you know there's. There's a trick to it. It's like a carnival trick, you know. It looks like, oh, that looks like okay, yeah, but no, there's a little. There's a little something to it. There's a little gimmick to it. There's a certain way that they do it. So, yeah, I mean, if you think about it, if you're on top of someone and you're gonna throw elbows, the the 11 to 5 Would do the most amount of damage. You know, like, think of Kenny Florian, like, when you're throwing those crazy elbows, you're throwing them across your, your body. You're not, you can't generate the power like you said. It's it's a silly thing. I'm glad they're changing it. But yeah, sports are fixed.

Tom Higgins: 1:20:06

Straight up, straight up. Bread and circus doesn't matter the sport. We all including us truthers and truth seekers, conspiracy theorists as you, if you will we need our escape and distraction once in a while too, especially when you're constantly flooding your mind with this type of shit. It's not bad to have a little sheeple escape, if you will, once in a while. Like I still enjoy MMA, like I don't really watch any other sports, but if I'm hanging out with my dad or whatever, I'm at a family party and they got a fucking game on or something like Sure, I'll watch it. I'll do what I can to try and enjoy it. But yeah, I kind of watch it with the same, same perspective as Brian. Take the fan hat off and I'm almost like breaking down the symbolism and all. What are they trying to push on us now? All right, well, yeah, if you're digging what we're laying out there.

Mike Straus: 1:20:48

Man, go give us a five star review on whatever platform you're listening to us on. Give us a follow like, subscribe, share, do all that good stuff. We appreciate all you listeners all over the world and up up. In a way, we're bringing this thing to the next level. We we got the remote mic fixed. We're gonna be doing some.

Tom Higgins: 1:21:06

Tom and I are gonna be getting together soon doing some in the same studio.

Mike Straus: 1:21:11

We're gonna be and video and yeah, a lot of shit going on. Man a lot of Watch out guys. My tech, my tech skills are leveling up, watch out.

Tom Higgins: 1:21:18

Geez, if I was ever sounding like shit in some of these old episodes. So thanks for Tolerating my technical difficulties, both mic and the listeners. If anyone has a topic they want us to cover, if they want to be a guest themselves. If you're an expert on something, if you got a guest, reach out to us, message us, even just have a good chat with us. We want to hear some feedback from you guys. You